Томас Джефферсон
The Writings of Thomas Jefferson, Vol. 1 (of 9)
TO MR. CARMICHAEL
Paris, October 18, 1785.
Dear Sir,—Your favor of the 29th of September, came safely to hand: the constant expectation of the departure of the persons whom I formerly gave you reason to expect has prevented my writing, as it has done yours. They will probably leave this in a week, but their route will be circuitous and attended with delays. Between the middle and last of November, they may be with you. By them, you will receive a cypher, by which you may communicate with Mr. Adams and myself. I should have sent it by Baron Dreyer, the Danish minister; but I then expected our own conveyance would have been quicker. Having mentioned this gentleman, give me leave to recommend him to your acquaintance. He is plain, sensible, and open: he speaks English well, and had he been to remain here, I should have cultivated his acquaintance much. Be so good as to present me very respectfully to him.
This being to go by post, I shall only add the few articles of general American news, by the last packet. Dr. Franklin arrived in good health at Philadelphia, the 15th ult., and was received amidst the acclamations of an immense crowd. No late event has produced greater demonstrations of joy. It is doubted whether Congress will adjourn this summer; but they are so thin, they do not undertake important business. Our western posts are in statu quo.
I have the honor to be, with great esteem, dear Sir, your friend and servant.
TO COUNT DE ARANDA
Paris, October 22, 1785.
Sir,—The friendly dispositions which the Court of Madrid have been pleased to show towards us in our affairs relative to the Barbary Powers, induce me to trouble you with an application on that subject. We are about sending persons to Morocco and Algiers to form arrangements with those powers. They will go by the way of Madrid. I ask the favor of your Excellency's passports for them. It would increase their value much if they could protect those persons from having their baggage searched. The one going to Morocco takes with him about a thousand guineas worth of watches, rings, and other things of that nature: he who goes to Algiers takes about a fourth of that value. I pledge myself that these, with their necessary clothes, will constitute the whole of their baggage, and that these are neither to be sold nor left in Spain. The duties to which these things would be subject are of no consideration with us. It is to avoid the delays, the difficulties, and even the losses which may accrue from the examination of small and precious things on the road. Two separate passports will be acceptable: the one for Thomas Barclay, and David S. Franks, and their servants; the other for John Lambe and – Randall, and their servants. We propose to keep these transactions as much as we can from the eyes of the public.
I have the honor to be, with the highest respect and esteem, your Excellency's most obedient and most humble servant.
TO MESSRS. VAN STAPHORSTS
Paris, October 25, 1785.
Gentlemen,—I received yesterday your favor of the 20th instant. In order to give you the information you desire on the subject of the liquidated debts of the United States, and the comparative footing on which they stand, I must observe to you, that the first and great division of our federal debt, is, into 1, foreign; and 2, domestic. The foreign debt comprehends, 1, the loan from the government of Spain; 2, the loans from the government of France, and from the Farmers General; 3, the loans negotiated in Holland, by order of Congress. This branch of our debt stands absolutely singular; no man in the United States having ever supposed that Congress, or their legislatures, can, in any wise, modify or alter it. They justly view the United States as the one party, and the lenders as the other, and that the consent of both would be requisite, were any modification to be proposed. But with respect to the domestic debt, they consider Congress as representing both the borrowers and lenders, and that the modifications which have taken place in this have been necessary to do justice between the two parties, and that they flowed properly from Congress as their mutual umpire. The domestic debt comprehends 1, the army debt; 2, the loan office debt; 3, the liquidated debt; and 4, the unliquidated debt. The first term includes debts to the officers and soldiers for pay, bounty and subsistence. The second term means moneys put into the loan office of the United States. The third comprehends all debts contracted by quarter-masters, commissaries, and others duly authorized to procure supplies for the army, and which have been liquidated (that is, settled) by commissioners appointed under the resolution of Congress, of June the 12th, 1780, or by the officer who made the contract. The fourth comprehends the whole mass of debts, described in the preceding article, which have not yet been liquidated. These are in a course of liquidation, and are passing over daily into the third class. The debts of this third class, that is, the liquidated debt, is the object of your inquiry. No time is fixed for the payment of it, no fund as yet determined, nor any firm provision for the interest in the meantime. The consequence is, that the certificates of these debts sell greatly below par. When I left America, they could be bought for from two shillings and sixpence to fifteen shillings in the pound: this difference proceeding from the circumstance of some States having provided for paying the interest on those due in their own State, which others had not. Hence, an opinion had arisen with some, and propositions had even been made in the legislatures, for paying off the principal of these debts with what they had cost the holder, and interest on that. This opinion is far from being general, and I think will not prevail. But it is among possible events.
I have been thus particular, that you may be able to judge, not only in the present case, but also in others, should any attempts be made to speculate in your city, on these papers. It is a business, in which foreigners will be in great danger of being duped. It is a science which bids defiance to the powers of reason. To understand it, a man must not only be on the spot, and be perfectly possessed of all the circumstances relative to every species of these papers, but he must have that dexterity which the habit of buying and selling them alone gives. The brokers of these certificates are few in number, and any other person venturing to deal with them, engages in a very unequal contest.
I have the honor to be, with the highest respect, gentlemen, your most obedient humble servant.
TO WILLIAM CARMICHAEL
Paris, November 4, 1785.
Dear Sir,—I had the honor of writing you on the 18th of October, and again, on the 25th of the same month. Both letters, being to pass through the post offices, were confined to particular subjects. The first of them acknowledged the receipt of yours, of September the 29th.
At length a confidential opportunity arrives for conveying to you a cypher; it will be handed you by the bearer, Mr. Lambe. Copies of it are in the hands of Mr. Adams, at London, Mr. Barclay, who is proceeding to Morocco, and Mr. Lambe, who is proceeding to Algiers. This enables us to keep up such correspondences with each other, as may be requisite. Congress, in the spring of 1784, gave powers to Mr. Adams, Dr. Franklin and myself, to treat with the Barbary States. But they gave us no money for them, and the other duties assigned us render it impossible for us to proceed thither in person. These things having been represented to them, they assigned to us a certain sum of money, and gave us powers to delegate agents to treat with those States, and to form preliminary articles, but confining to us the signing of them in a definitive form. They did not restrain us in the appointment of the agents; but the orders of Congress were brought to us by Mr. Lambe, they had waited for him four months, and the recommendations he brought pointed him out, in our opinion, as a person who would meet the approbation of Congress. We therefore appointed him to negotiate with the Algerines. His manners and appearance are not promising. But he is a sensible man, and seems to possess some talents which may be proper in a matter of bargain. We have joined with him, as secretary, a Mr. Randall, from New York, in whose prudence we hope he will find considerable aid. They now proceed to Madrid, merely with the view of seeing you, as we are assured they will receive from you lights which may be useful to them. I hear that d'Expilly and the Algerine ministers have gone from Madrid. Letters from Algiers, of August the 24th, inform me that we had two vessels and their crews in captivity there, at that time. I never had reason to believe, certainly, that any others had been captured. Should Mr. Lambe have occasion to draw bills, while in Spain, on Mr. Adams, you may safely assure the purchasers that they will be paid.
An important matter detains Mr. Barclay some days longer, and his journey to Madrid will be circuitous. Perhaps he may arrive there a month later than Lambe. It would be well if the Emperor of Morocco could, in the meantime, know that such a person is on the road. Perhaps you may have an opportunity of notifying this to him officially, by asking from him passports for Mr. Barclay and his suite. This would be effecting two good purposes at once, if you can find an opportunity.
Your letter of September the 2d, did not get to my hands till these arrangements were all taken between Mr. Adams and myself, and the persons appointed. That gave me the first hint that you would have acted in this business. I mean no flattery when I assure you, that no person would have better answered my wishes. At the same time, I doubt whether Mr. Adams and myself should have thought ourselves justifiable in withdrawing a servant of the United States from a post equally important with those which prevented our acting personally in the same business. I am sure, that, remaining where you are, you will be able to forward much the business, and that you will do it with a zeal you have hitherto manifested on every occasion.
Your intercourse with America being less frequent than ours, from this place, I will state to you, generally, such new occurrences there, as may be interesting; some of which, perhaps, you will not have been informed of. It was doubtful, at the date of my last letters, whether Congress would adjourn this summer. They were too thin, however, to undertake important business. They had begun arrangements for the establishment of a mint. The Dollar was decided on as the money Unit of America. I believe, they proposed to have gold, silver and copper coins, descending and ascending decimally; viz., a gold coin of ten dollars, a silver coin of one-tenth of a dollar (equal to a Spanish bit), and a copper coin of one-hundredth of a dollar. These parts of the plan, however, were not ultimately decided on. They have adopted the late improvement in the British post office, of sending their mails by the stages. I am told, this is done from New Hampshire to Georgia, and from New York to Albany. Their treasury is administered by a board, of which Mr. Walter Livingston, Mr. Osgood, and Dr. Arthur Lee, are members. Governor Rutledge, who had been appointed minister to the Hague, on the refusal of Governor Livingston, declines coming. We are uncertain whether the States will generally come into the proposition of investing Congress with the regulation of their commerce. Massachusetts has passed an act, the first object of which seemed to be, to retaliate on the British commercial measures, but in the close of it, they impose double duties on all goods imported in bottoms not wholly owned by citizens of our States. New Hampshire has followed the example. This is much complained of here, and will probably draw retaliating measures from the States of Europe, if generally adopted in America, or not corrected by the States which have adopted it. It must be our endeavor to keep them quiet on this side the water, under the hope that our countrymen will correct this step; as I trust they will do. It is no ways akin to their general system. I am trying here to get contracts for the supplying the cities of France with whale oil, by the Boston merchants. It would be the greatest relief possible to that State, whose commerce is in agonies, in consequence of being subjected to alien duties on their oil, in Great Britain, which has been heretofore their only market. Can anything be done, in this way, in Spain? Or do they there light their streets in the night?
A fracas, which has lately happened in Boston, becoming a serious matter, I will give you the details of it, as transmitted to Mr. Adams in depositions. A Captain Stanhope, commanding the frigate Mercury, was sent with a convoy of vessels from Nova Scotia to Boston, to get a supply of provisions for that colony. It had happened, that two persons living near Boston, of the names of Dunbar and Lowthorp, had been taken prisoners during the war, and transferred from one vessel to another, till they were placed on board Stanhope's ship. He treated them most cruelly, whipping them frequently, in order to make them do duty against their country, as sailors, on board his ship. The ship going to Antigua to refit, he put all his prisoners into jail, first giving Dunbar twenty-four lashes. Peace took place, and the prisoners got home under the general liberation. These men were quietly pursuing their occupations at home, when they heard that Stanhope was in Boston. Their indignation was kindled. They immediately went there, and, meeting Stanhope walking in the mall, Dunbar stepped up to him, and asked him if he recollected him, and the whipping him on board his ship. Having no weapon in his hand, he struck at Stanhope with his fist. Stanhope stepped back and drew his sword. The people interposed, and guarded him to the door of a Mr. Morton, to which he retreated. There, Dunbar again attempted to seize him; but the high sheriff had by this time arrived, who interposed and protected him. The assailants withdrew, and here ended all appearance of force. But Captain Stanhope thought proper to write to the Governor, which brought on the correspondence published in the papers of Europe. Lest you should not have seen it, I enclose it, as cut from a London paper; though not perfectly exact, it is substantially so. You will doubtless judge, that Governor Bowdoin referred him properly to the laws for redress, as he was obliged to do, and as would have been done in England, in a like case. Had he applied to the courts, the question would have been, whether they would have punished Dunbar? This must be answered now by conjecture only; and, to form that conjecture, every man must ask himself whether he would not have done as Dunbar did? And whether the people should not have permitted him to return to Stanhope the twenty-four lashes? This affair has been stated in the London papers, without mixing with it one circumstance of truth.
In your letter of the 27th of June, you were so good as to tell me, that you should shortly send off some of the books I had taken the liberty to ask you to get for me, and that your correspondent at Bayonne, would give me notice of their arrival there. Not having heard from him, I mention it to you, lest they should be stopped anywhere.
I am, with great respect, dear Sir, your most obedient humble servant.
TO RICHARD O'BRYAN
Paris, November 4, 1785.
Sir,—I wrote you a short letter on the 29th of September, acknowledging the receipt of yours of August the 24th, from Algiers, and promising that you should hear further from me soon. Mr. Adams, the American minister at London, and myself, have agreed to authorize the bearer hereof, Mr. Lambe, to treat for your redemption, and that of your companions taken in American vessels, and, if it can be obtained for sums within our power, we shall have the money paid. But in this, we act without instruction from Congress, and are therefore obliged to take the precaution of requiring, that you bind your owners for yourself and crew, and the other captain, in like manner, his owners for himself and crew, and that each person, separately, make himself answerable for his own redemption, in case Congress requires it. I suppose Congress will not require it; but we have no authority to decide that, but must leave it to their own decision; which renders necessary the precautions I have mentioned, in order to justify ourselves for undertaking to redeem you, without orders. Mr. Lambe is instructed to make no bargain without your approbation, and that of the other prisoners, each for himself. We also direct him to relieve your present necessities. I sincerely wish you a speedy deliverance from your distresses, and a happy return to your family.
I am, Sir, your most obedient humble servant.
TO W. W. SEWARD
Paris, November 12, 1785.
Sir,—I received the honor of your letter of the 25th ult., written by desire of the associated company of Irish merchants, in London, and return you thanks for the kind congratulations you express therein. The freedom of commerce between Ireland and America is undoubtedly very interesting to both countries. If fair play be given to the natural advantages of Ireland, she must come in for a distinguished share of that commerce. She is entitled to it, from the excellence of some of her manufactures, the cheapness of most of them, their correspondence with the American taste, a sameness of language, laws and manners, a reciprocal affection between the people, and the singular circumstance of her being the nearest European land to the United States. I am not at present so well acquainted with the trammels of Irish commerce, as to know what they are, particularly, which obstruct the intercourse between Ireland and America; nor, therefore, what can be the object of a fleet stationed in the western ocean, to intercept that intercourse. Experience, however, has taught us to infer that the fact is probable, because it is impolitic. On the supposition that this interruption will take place, you suggest Ostend as a convenient entrepôt for the commerce between America and Ireland. Here, too, I find myself, on account of the same ignorance of your commercial regulations, at a loss to say why this is preferable to L'Orient, which, you know, is a free port and in great latitude, which is nearer to both parties, and accessible by a less dangerous navigation. I make no doubt, however, that the reasons of the preference are good. You find by this essay, that I am not likely to be a very instructive correspondent; you shall find me, however, zealous in whatever may concern the interests of the two countries. The system, into which the United States wished to go, was that of freeing commerce from every shackle. A contrary conduct in Great Britain will occasion them to adopt the contrary system, at least as to that island. I am sure they would be glad, if it should be found practicable, to make that discrimination between Great Britain and Ireland, which their commercial principles, and their affection for the latter, would dictate.
I have the honor to be, with the highest respect for yourself and the company for whom you write, Sir, your most obedient and most humble servant.
TO THE COUNT DE VERGENNES
Paris, November 14, 1785.
Sir,—I take the liberty of troubling your Excellency on behalf of six citizens of the United States, who have been, for some time, confined in the prison of St. Pol de Leon, and of referring for particulars, to the enclosed state of their case. Some of the material facts, therein mentioned, are founded on the bill of sale for the vessel, her clearance from Baltimore, and her log book. The originals of the two last, and a copy of the first, are in my hands. I have, also, letters from a merchant in Liverpool to Asquith, which render it really probable that his vessel was bound to Liverpool. The other circumstances depend on their affirmation, but I must say, that in these facts, they have been uniform and steady. I have thus long avoided troubling your Excellency with this case, in hopes it would receive its decision, in the ordinary course of law, and I relied, that that would indemnify the sufferers, if they had been used unjustly; but though they have been in close confinement, now near three months, it has yet no appearance of approaching to decision. In the meantime, the cold of the winter is coming on, and, to men in their situation, may produce events which would render all indemnification too late. I must, therefore, pray the assistance of your Excellency, for the liberation of their persons, if the established order of things may possibly admit of it. As to their property, and their personal sufferings hitherto, I have full confidence that the laws have provided some tribunal, where justice will be done them. I enclose the opinion of an advocate, forwarded to me by a gentleman whom I had desired to obtain, from some judicious person of that faculty, a state of their case. This may perhaps give a better idea than I can, of the situation of their cause. His inquiries have led him to believe they are innocent men, but that they must lose their vessel under the edict, which forbids those under thirty tons to approach the coast. Admitting their innocence, as he does, I should suppose them not the objects, on whom such an edict was meant to operate. The essential papers, which he says they re-demanded from him, and did not return, were sent to me, at my desire.
I am, with sentiments of the highest respect, your Excellency's most obedient, and most humble servant.
The case of Lister Asquith, owner of the schooner William and Catharine, William M'Neil, captain, William Thomson, William Neily, Robert Anderson, mariners, and William Fowler, passenger.
Lister Asquith, citizen of the State of Maryland, having a law-suit depending in England, which required his presence, as involving in its issue nearly his whole fortune, determined to go thither in a small schooner of his own, that he might, at the same time, take with him an adventure of tobacco and flour to Liverpool, where he had commercial connections. This schooner he purchased as of fifty-nine and a quarter tons, as appears by his bill of sale, but she had been registered by her owner at twenty-one tons, in order to evade the double duties in England, to which American vessels are now subject. He cleared out from Baltimore for Liverpool, the 11th of June, 1785, with eight hogsheads of tobacco and sixty barrels of flour, but ran aground at Smith's point, sprung a leak, and was obliged to return to Baltimore to refit. Having stopped his leak, he took his cargo on board again, and his health being infirm, he engaged Captain William M'Neil115 to go with him, and, on the 20th of June, sailed for Norfolk in Virginia, and, on the 22d, came to in Hampton road, at the mouth of the river on which Norfolk is. Learning here that tobacco would be better than flour for the English market, he landed fifty barrels of his flour and one hogshead of tobacco, which he found to be bad, meaning to take, instead thereof, nine hogsheads of tobacco more. But the same night it began to blow very hard, with much rain. The 23d, the storm became more heavy; they let go both their anchors, but were driven, notwithstanding, from their anchorage, forced to put to sea and to go before the wind. The occurrences of their voyage will be best detailed by short extracts from the log-book.
June 24. The weather becomes worse. One of the fore shrouds and the foremast carried away.
June 25. Shifted their ballast which threw them on their beam ends, and shipped a very heavy sea. Held a consultation, the result of which was, that seeing they were now driven so far to sea, and the weather continuing still very bad, it was better to steer for Liverpool, their port of destination, though they had not their cargo on board, and no other clearance but that which they took from Baltimore.
June 29. The first observation they had been able to take N. lat. 38° 13´.
June 30. Winds begin to be light, but the sea still very heavy.
July 5. Light winds and a smooth sea for the first time, in lat. 43° 12´.
July 9. Spoke a French brig, Comte d'Artois, Captain Mieaux, from St. Maloes, in distress for provisions. Relieved her with three barrels of flour.
Aug. 6. Thick weather and a strong wind. Made the Lands' End of England.
Aug. 7. Unable to fetch the land, therefore bore off for Scilly, and came to with both anchors. Drove, notwithstanding, and obliged to get up the anchors, and put to sea, running southwardly.
Aug. 8. Made the land of France, but did not know what part.
Here the logbook ends. At this time they had on board but ten gallons of water, four or five barrels of bread, two or three pounds of candles, no firewood. Their sails unfit to be trusted to any longer, and all their materials for mending them exhausted by the constant repairs which the violence of the weather had called for. They therefore took a pilot aboard, who carried them into Pont Duval; but being informed by the captain of a vessel there that the schooner was too sharp built (as the American vessels mostly are) to lie in that port, they put out immediately, and the next morning the pilot brought them to anchor in the road of the Isle de Bas. Asquith went immediately to Roscaff, protested at the admiralty the true state of his case, and reported his vessel and cargo at the custom-house. In making the report of his vessel, he stated her as of twenty-one tons, according to his register. The officer informed him that if she was no larger, she would be confiscated by an edict, which forbids all vessels under thirty tons to approach the coast. He told the officer what was the real truth as to his register and his bill of sale, and was permitted to report her according to the latter. He paid the usual fees of ten livres and seven sols, and obtained a clearance. Notwithstanding this, he was soon visited by other persons whom he supposes to have been commis of the Fermes, who seized his vessel, carried her to the pier, and confined the crew to the vessel and half the pier, putting sentinels over them. They brought a guager, who measured only her hold and part of her steerage, allowing nothing for the cockpit, cabin, forecastle, and above one-half of the steerage, which is almost half the vessel, and thus made her contents (if that had been of any importance) much below the truth. The tobacco was weighed, and found to be six thousand four hundred and eighty-seven pounds,116 which was sent on the 18th to Landivisian, and on the 19th they were committed to close prison at St. Pol de Leon, where they have been confined ever since. They had, when they first landed, some money, of which they were soon disembarrassed by different persons, who, in various forms, undertook to serve them. Unable to speak or understand a word of the language of the country, friendless, and left without money, they have languished three months in a loathsome jail, without any other sustenance, a great part of the time, than what could be procured for three sous a day, which have been furnished them to prevent their perishing.
They have been made to understand that a criminal process is going on against them under two heads. 1. As having sold tobacco in contraband; and 2, as having entered a port of France in a vessel of less than thirty tons burthen. In support of the first charge, they understand that the circumstance is relied on, of their having been seen off the coast by the employés des Fermes one or two days. They acknowledge they may have been so seen while beating off Pont Duval till they could get a pilot while entering that port, and again going round from thence to the road of the Isle de Bas. The reasons for this have been explained. They further add, that all the time they were at Pont Duval they had a King's officer on board, from whom, as well as from their pilot and the captain, by whose advice they left that port for the Isle de Bas, information can be obtained by their accusers (who are not imprisoned), of the true motives for that measure. It is said to be urged also, that there was found in their vessel some loose tobacco in a blanket, which excites a suspicion that they had been selling tobacco. When they were stowing their loading, they broke a hogshead, as is always necessary, and is always done, to fill up the stowage, and to consolidate and keep the whole mass firm, and in place. The loose tobacco which had come out of the broken hogshead, they repacked in bags; but in the course of the distress of their disastrous voyage, they had employed these bags, as they had done everything else of the same nature, in mending their sails. The condition of their sails, when they came into port, will prove this, and they were seen by witnesses enough, to whom their accusers, being at their liberty, can have access. Besides, the sale of a part of their tobacco is a fact which, had it taken place, might have been proved; but they deny that it has been proved, or ever can be proved by true men, because it never existed. And they hope the justice of this country does not permit strangers, seeking in her ports an asylum from death, to be thrown into jail and continued there indefinitely, on the possibility of a fact, without any proof. More especially when, as in the present case, a demonstration to the contrary is furnished by their clearance, which shows they never had more than eight hogsheads of tobacco on board, of which one had been put ashore at Hampton in Virginia, as has been before related, and the seven others remained when they first entered port. If they had been smugglers of tobacco, the opposite coast offered a much fairer field, because the gain there is as great; because they understand the language and laws of the country, they know its harbors and coasts, and have connections in them. These circumstances are so important to smugglers, that it is believed no instance has ever occurred of the contraband of tobacco, attempted on this side the channel by a crew wholly American. Be this as it may, they are not of that description of men.
